PVP'ing concerns.

[King Kong]

The casting, is not a huge difference -- I have watched pvp over and over, and this is the conclusion I got.

The potions, the delay is here to stay, nothing will change my mind on that. -- I know that for sure.


The casting times, If you read the patch notes, I said I will tweak as I go, meaning nothing perm. -- But look at it from my point of view... All this talk because poison and harms (the 2 most used spells) are .4 seconds slower...

Now 2 things come to my mind, we have really bad pvpers, or people who script so much and their mad their scripts are not working properly.

But if you read my update, I say I will tweak as I go.

Of course people complain, always will, always do -- When I say if you don't like it, leave. It's me proving a point that, what YOUR REALLY complaining about is actualy pretty minute in the scheme of things. Puts things in perspective for them. -- I didn't say I wasn't reading all of this and taking notes.

 8-)

[Lithium66]

After reading everything and taking notes I just realized i'm king and your queen all because H20 is taking the brunt again LOL naw just joking hahaha.

By the way Kon you can't be so harsh except to me cause i can take what I dish out etc so I expect you to be on your best behavior from here on out in the forumns or I'll have to scold you :lol:

[enrod]

I never once said anything about throwing in a towel. The issue here is the ineffectiveness of common fireballs. This is 4/8 casting, and if people don't like that then they should go to another 2/6, they're easy to find. Instead fireballs, poisons, and harms have been rendered useless because they "cast too fast"? I don't use razor macro's for my spells, most of my keyboard is binded to a different spell. I find it rare for most of the pvp'ers out there in the field using the same kind of setup as myself. I'm not bitching about my script not working, I'm bitching because the affect of those three spells on pvp is huge. Poison spell is useless now. IF you don't land it, you can't try again until you could have almost landed an explosion. When spells were previously casted in milliseconds, every millisecond makes a difference.

The main issue here is, key spells are being removed when it is already hard enough to kill players who are fully suited.

[King Kong]

I never once said anything about throwing in a towel. The issue here is the ineffectiveness of common fireballs. This is 4/8 casting, and if people don't like that then they should go to another 2/6, they're easy to find. Instead fireballs, poisons, and harms have been rendered useless because they "cast too fast"? I don't use razor macro's for my spells, most of my keyboard is binded to a different spell. I find it rare for most of the pvp'ers out there in the field using the same kind of setup as myself. I'm not bitching about my script not working, I'm bitching because the affect of those three spells on pvp is huge. Poison spell is useless now. IF you don't land it, you can't try again until you could have almost landed an explosion. When spells were previously casted in milliseconds, every millisecond makes a difference.

The main issue here is, key spells are being removed when it is already hard enough to kill players who are fully suited.

If you see other spells, like lighting, FS etc -- they got minor buffs, and with out pot chugging, players will actually be able to kill players faster

Poison is still very effective, I am watching people use it great as I type this -- Also this makes you think out side of the box -- add poison to a weapon, bring back the fast hitting cleaver -- hit someone with a fukiya dart -- etc

Not to mention I will adjust as we go -- but no, both those spells are fully useful. I am not sure if you have really tried it out yet.

[Ewua]

Hi there Guys..this is what I think as the most consistent pvper in shard...

The staff have done a great job with pandora no mistakes.  But I would like the staff to take a stepback and look at how the pvp changes will take a domino effect...

The cast does not bother me one bit, its just a matter of getting use to.  But I would like you guys to take in consideration that before the new pvp system, PVP was already PERFECTLY balanced.  The system of fast casting was balanced by the 2sec bandage.  

Now...we have to realize that each suited player has around 180hp, with the delayed fireball and poison.  There is absolutely no way even as unbeatable as I have been, will I be able to drop an average player.  Before, the damage generated was being MATCHED by the 2sec bandage heal.  But now...the 2sec bandage heal is out healing the damage.

I do believe Kon that we will adjust to the delay casting.  But if the delay casting is going to stay you have to consider the domino effect... to BALANCE the HEAL and DAMAGE.

The 2sec bandage heal will have to be higher! around 8sec or so.  
Lower our HP to around 130-140 or so..even with the 8sec aid heal, I do not believe I can generate enough damage to take out someone as geared at 180hp as I am, in a skilled manner like i've been doing.
--cure/archcure will have to have delay casting as well, because we have to balance the poison/cure..just like damage/heal
--then we have to consider that our weapons would be doing too much damage, lowering it to 1 hit spells...and etc.
-capping crushing blows and double shot to 35 dmg like armor ignore.

As of right now...how things are,  no one is able to kill another.  There is no skill involved because we are simply relying on Weapon damage which is INCONSISTENT.  Yes my first attempt at new system pvp was against Tyrone, it took me 11min to beat him.  His bandage heal out heals the damage that I was generating... I beat him because I hit him with 5 special weapon abilities in a row... that to me has nothing to do with how good i am, i did not setup a combo or anything.  I could not finish him off because his cure/heal would out cure/heal my incoming damage/poison.
--I've always been at the top dailypvp because i do not rely on weapon damage.  I remained consistent because I use spells to setup combos and spells always hit, not weapons.  And its looking like we have to rely more on weapon to do the damage that fb/poison could not atm.

These are just my thoughts about the new pvp system.  Thanks for taking your precious time to read my thoughts.

[King Kong]

Hi there Guys..this is what I think as the most consistent pvper in shard...

The staff have done a great job with pandora no mistakes.  But I would like the staff to take a stepback and look at how the pvp changes will take a domino effect...

The cast does not bother me one bit, its just a matter of getting use to.  But I would like you guys to take in consideration that before the new pvp system, PVP was already PERFECTLY balanced.  The system of fast casting was balanced by the 2sec bandage.  

Now...we have to realize that each suited player has around 180hp, with the delayed fireball and poison.  There is absolutely no way even as unbeatable as I have been, will I be able to drop an average player.  Before, the damage generated was being MATCHED by the 2sec bandage heal.  But now...the 2sec bandage heal is out healing the damage.

I do believe Kon that we will adjust to the delay casting.  But if the delay casting is going to stay you have to consider the domino effect... to BALANCE the HEAL and DAMAGE.

The 2sec bandage heal will have to be higher! around 8sec or so.  
Lower our HP to around 130-140 or so..even with the 8sec aid heal, I do not believe I can generate enough damage to take out someone as geared at 180hp as I am, in a skilled manner like i've been doing.
--cure/archcure will have to have delay casting as well, because we have to balance the poison/cure..just like damage/heal
--then we have to consider that our weapons would be doing too much damage, lowering it to 1 hit spells...and etc.
-capping crushing blows and double shot to 35 dmg like armor ignore.

As of right now...how things are,  no one is able to kill another.  There is no skill involved because we are simply relying on Weapon damage which is INCONSISTENT.  Yes my first attempt at new system pvp was against Tyrone, it took me 11min to beat him.  His bandage heal out heals the damage that I was generating... I beat him because I hit him with 5 special weapon abilities in a row... that to me has nothing to do with how good i am, i did not setup a combo or anything.  I could not finish him off because his cure/heal would out cure/heal my incoming damage/poison.
--I've always been at the top dailypvp because i do not rely on weapon damage.  I remained consistent because I use spells to setup combos and spells always hit, not weapons.  And its looking like we have to rely more on weapon to do the damage that fb/poison could not atm.

These are just my thoughts about the new pvp system.  Thanks for taking your precious time to read my thoughts.

Thank you for this -- these are the kind of replies I need, helps more. They come with facts and respect.


I am looking into tweaking the cure and heal spell -- and possible making fireball do more damage since it takes a bit longer to cast, is naturally delayed, and uses a bit more mana ..

Crushing blows and double hit will be looked into -- those abilities are a bit more complex so I didn't have enough time to fully dive in those, but it one of the top things next on my list.

Keep note the changes I made more effect the group pvp -- I really havnt yet dived into the 1v1 (which obviously is going to be effected by changing the group, which I will adjust)

I just want to give it this weekend and watch your guys pvp -- that's the best really know what to do  -- Also needs to give you guys a couple days to adjust to things. -- Not promising anything but also won't leave anyone in the dark -- You guys know me by now, in the long run I always make things right. Have faith in the King.

 8-)

[Nemesis]

I haven't been playing as much as i used to as i've been pretty busy lately but i logged on yesterday and here are my thoughts about the recent changes.

I never really been a PVMer and probably never will but i think most the fixes that were made to  the economy are good ones, With all the bad ass gear everyone has, monsters had to be made harder and stuff harder to get otherwise all the prices would have eventually dropped to the floor. I was seeing it already with imbuing mats and how cheap people were selling them. A server with no economy is sure to not last long because new players wont have a way to make gold when they start. Right now it might be alot harder to kill mini champs (i haven't tried) but new players can start with taming and go kill everything a Gdragon and actually make some gold instead of getting mats that would have eventually been worthless.


Now onto to the PVP changes.

I agree with some of what Ewua said, the problem isn't actually that spells are slower to cast, everyone can get used to that. The problem is that the pvp here was already perfectly fine, it was extremely fast paced and that is what made it unique.

But like i said slower spells is something anyone can get used to as long as everything else gets balanced accordingly. I tried a couple duels with the new casting and i absolutely hated it, not because i couldn't get my spells to hit but because bandages are now too quick for the casting speed. Poison spell doesnt land everytime but when i managed to land one it'd get cured instantly by bandages, barely had time to cast a fireball or a harm before it got cured. So i think that if your gonna go this way with basically reducing the pvp speed, weapons and bandages need to get balanced. Cause the way it is casting has become kinda useless, everyone is gonna rely on their weapon dmg (i hate that... doesn't take any skills to get crushing blows or mortals to hit). So by lowering the bandage speed you can make the spells useful again as the poison won't get cured as fast or people wont get heal as fast and will have to use heal / gheal instead of relying only on their bandages. I don't agree with the 8 sec bandages Ewua was saying tho cause that'd be way too slow with 1.25 swing speed you could hit 6 times before a bandage would even go off. 4 seconds would probably fine.

But also if you change bandage speed you also need to lower damage from weapon, capping dmg from crushing blow and double strike like AI is capped is a good idea. I don't think lowering it to 1 hitspell max on a weap could be considered, just think about everyone who spent hours farming to get the mats to make their weapons what would you tell them...? ''Sorry weapons do too much dmg now all your weapons are gonna get deleted now you gotta go farm again and make new ones''. Baaaaddd idea, if when imbuing was first introduced on the server it was put that way 1 hitspell cap everything would have been fine but that's not how it was introduced. What could be a fix for that (i dunno if its possible) would be to lower the damage done by hitspells on weapon like make it maybe 50 or 75% of their original dmg so let's say a lightning would normally do 30 dmg it could make 15 or 22.5 instead. Would make weapon do a little less dmg without having to redo them all.

[King Kong]

Thank you Nemesis .. Noted


More tweaks will be coming next week